Renouncing immoral behaviors
The Journal has been quoting various religious ministers in its marriage-amendment articles who denounce Amendment One as discriminatory against homosexuals. I'm no theologian, but my Christian Bible presents homosexual acts as deviant. Read Romans 1:26-27, among others.
Upholding the true dignity of human people requires renouncing those immoral behaviors that denigrate our likeness to God, because they do not reflect his divine nature. Neither does accepting and enshrining into law what he rejects in his divine moral law as written in Scripture. We need only look to abortion, which violates the dignity of women and unborn children, to see our folly in this errant train of thought.
My Bible also states "a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife and the two shall become one flesh" (Gen 2:24). Marriage is a divine institution, ordained by God as between man and woman. He created male and female anatomy and chemistry to be complementary. They fit together and become one body, mind, heart and soul. This union reflects the authentic image of God's covenant love because by his grace working through nature, husband and wife can share in his divine work of creation that began in the garden. It also mirrors Christ the Bridegroom's love for his bride, the church (Ephesians Chapter 5).
Tampering with the authentic revelation of marriage will further erode the stability and security of the family and society and any redefinition of marriage is counterfeit and discriminates against God.
MARY POEHAILOS
Clemmons
Hateful and redundant
I am writing to urge everyone to vote against Amendment One. It is hateful and it is redundant. Gay marriage is already forbidden in this state.
This amendment would also close the door to civil unions for gay and straight couples alike. It will negatively impact the economy and more importantly the lives of thousands of our fellow citizens. Vote against the amendment.
DARREN STALEY
Millers Creek
Taking exception
In response to the April 21 letter "Against Motsinger," I have to take exception to the writer's reasoning.
He claims he is against Elisabeth Motsinger's candidacy for 5th Congressional District because she has a "progressive agenda." According to Webster's Unabridged Dictionary, progressive means "favoring or advocating progress, change, improvement, or reform." It also means "making progress toward better conditions."
I'm sorry, but when did this become a bad thing? Does the writer wish us all to support a candidate with a "regressive agenda"? Webster's defines this as "to move in a backward direction, having backward reasoning."
This doesn't sound like what we need as a people — a group of leaders afraid of change and progress.
This is why our country is in the shape it is in: Too many people afraid of progress.
KEVIN G. WEAVIL
Winston-Salem
Poor excuses for amendment
The prevalent arguments for Amendment One are
- the Bible says homosexuality is a sin
- we must protect marriage, and
- the people should decide.
These are poor excuses for this divisive amendment.
None of the few sentences in the Bible addressing homosexuality are attributed to Jesus, who was inclusive of all people, including those scorned by the religious hierarchy of his time. Leviticus prohibits many things Carolinians often do, such as eating barbecue or shrimp or marrying divorced women. Why not legislate against these personal behaviors? Another verse blesses slavery; should we rerun that abomination?
Is there any logical answer to the question "How does it harm my marriage or the marriages of others, if two people of the same sex are married?" The 14th Amendment guarantees equal protection of the laws and bans denying rights based on legal personal characteristics such as skin color (remember our shameful Jim Crow laws?) or sexual orientation.
"Let the people decide" appears to be an evasion by politicians (some of whom I regard as friends) desiring to "Pontius Pilate" the issue. How about letting the people decide about gerrymandering? Prostitution? Those who voted to put Amendment One on the ballot favor it.
The fact that other states have adopted unjust constitutional provisions denying equal protection of the laws to a classification of people is unpersuasive and Amendment One is an egregious example of such provisions.
Vote "No" and for enlightenment.
MURRAY C. GREASON JR.
Winston-Salem
Sum It Up
The Sum It Up question from Sunday was: What would happen if one took every verse of the Bible literally?
Total chaos and confusion.
BOB BURWELL
Christian fundamentalists wouldn't be hypocrites anymore.
KAM BENFIELD
We would have a different and better world.
ANN TEMPLETON
Most of us would be stoned to death.
We have to be able to distinguish between what is cultural and what is biblical.
CYNTHIA GOUGH NANCE
For everyone who believes the Bible, they do take every word literally. One has to know how to put it in context. It is so sad that everyone does not believe the Bible because Jesus Christ is coming back as he promised. For those who laugh at this, it will be too late when they are convinced that God created all and has all power. The disturbing letters in the Journal tell me that that number could be huge, depending on choices.
LEE JOHNSON
The problem is not with the Bible, but with our limited ability to interpret it correctly.
DONALD R. CREWS
There would be several new reality shows for demonstrating the proper way to "stone thy neighbor." There could also be one with the folks from Greenpeace out searching to sink shrimp boats. The crabbing industry would become a black market gold mine! The possibilities are endless!
JEFF BANNER
Then everyone would believe in unicorns as per the King James version: Job 39:9, 10, Isaiah 34:7, and seven other places in the Bible. Women also wouldn't be talking while in church as per 1 Corinthians 14:34, presumably so they can spend the time thinking about unicorns.
D.H. LEWIS
"And the meek shall inherit the earth." If that were true we wouldn't have the 99 percent while the other 1 percent gets everything.
SUZANNE CARROLL
If one takes every verse of the Bible as the literal revealed word of God, one cannot help but be left with the impression that He has no moral qualms with slavery.
DAVID LERNER
If we were to take every passage of the Bible as inerrant, we run the risk of selective, out of context interpretation and end up missing the true message of God's word. Too many people turn the Bible from being a tool to show us the way and into a weapon to bludgeon those we disagree with. I suggest all who use the Bible to make any political point remember two of Jesus' teachings: "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone," and his admonition for us to "remove the log from our own eye before we try and help someone with the speck in theirs."
KEN HOGLUND
I would settle for the one verse, "Love God with all your heart ... and your neighbor as yourself."
PETER VENABLE
Trying to take the Bible literally would make your head explode. No one actually does that. There are so many contradictions and inconsistencies, and so many differing translations. There is much in there we simply ignore. The faithful pick and choose and "interpret" and then call their choices literal.
Take a simple example, Deuteronomy 22:11, which in the King James Version says: "Thou shalt not wear a garment of diverse sorts, as of woolen and linen together." If you are wearing clothing typically sold in America you are likely in violation of a biblical decree because the cloth itself is a blend of "diverse sorts." Where is the furious and righteous cry for a return to God's decree against textile blends? There is great wisdom in the Bible, but if truly taken literally, crusading against spandex is where it gets you.
STEVE SCROGGIN
If we took every verse of the Bible literally, we would live in a different world. For instance, we could own slaves, and preference would be slaves from neighboring nations. I assume that would be Mexico or Canada (Leviticus 25:44). We could also sell our daughters into slavery (Exodus 21:7). If we have a neighbor working on the Sabbath (whatever day of the week that really is), I assume we would have to report him to the authorities, because he must be put to death (Exodus 35:2). This is just a sampling or how our lives might be different.
CHARLES FRANCIS WILSON
If everyone believed in a literal interpretation of the Bible, the world would be at peace, because men would be too tired to start wars after coming home to 700 wives.
RUDY DIAMOND
To begin with, it would be good if people read every verse of the Bible.
THE REV. LAURA SPANGLER
We should call ourselves the contemporary of Moses or Abraham.
BOON T. LEE
If you take every verse literally, you will be very misinformed. As any real student of the Bible knows, context is everything in understanding what it says. You have to know the whole Bible to understand what is literal and what is allegory.
RICHARD CHASE
That person would be lacking a basic understanding of the natural sciences, and utterly bereft of any common sense.
DAVE LASTER
If one took every verse in the Bible literally, we would not be voting on the marriage amendment. What God has said, He meant, whether we want to believe it or not. God will one day judge those who change His word to fit their own unholy lifestyles.
REID JOYCE
A big mess. Religion is the real cause of humanity's ills. Look at the religious right and Islam.
WILLIAM SAMS
I would invest in sleep-aid stocks.
WES PATTERSON
If you go forward with bad governmental policies, they can result in negative influences and consequences on society no matter what 'progressives' say. Merely attaching a positive word to something that is bad, doesn't automatically make it good.
ReplyDeleteFor example, the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act A/K/A Obamacare was sold as a bill of goods to 'reduce' healthcare costs. Most healthcare costs have actually gone UP as a result of the bill's passage, and it has even jeopardized some people's healthcare plans all together. Thus, making the name of the bill clearly deceptive.
Everybody should know by now that by putting a happy name on things is something that politicians have been doing for a while now. They lie to us everyday relating to all kinds of stuff. Let's don't fooled by yet again by believing being 'progressive' always means something 'good', especially coming from liberal politicians.
That Bob Burwell guy sure is in the mix on a lot of things.
ReplyDeleteAn interesting antidote to his comment is: If we don't follow the Bible, the Constitution, or laws for that matter in somewhat of a literal sense, why have them? Why don't we just let people do what they want and have chaos?
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteJohnny Edwards(D) represents all that's bad about politicians. And to think he ran for POTUS.
ReplyDeleteI'm sure Tony Weiner(D) will run one day.
Jeeez!
Any bets on whether or not Rielle Hunter A/K/A Queen Sheba, testifies?
DeleteThe King James Version > Ecclesiastes > 3
ReplyDeleteA Time for Everything
1 To every thing there is a season, and a time to every purpose under the heaven:
2 a time to be born, and a time to die; a time to plant, and a time to pluck up that which is planted;
3 a time to kill, and a time to heal; a time to break down, and a time to build up;
4 a time to weep, and a time to laugh; a time to mourn, and a time to dance;
5 a time to cast away stones, and a time to gather stones together; a time to embrace, and a time to refrain from embracing;
6 a time to get, and a time to lose; a time to keep, and a time to cast away;
7 a time to rend, and a time to sew; a time to keep silence, and a time to speak;
8 a time to love, and a time to hate; a time of war, and a time of peace.
9 What profit hath he that worketh in that wherein he laboreth?
10 ¶ I have seen the travail, which God hath given to the sons of men to be exercised in it.
11 He hath made every thing beautiful in his time: also he hath set the world in their heart, so that no man can find out the work that God maketh from the beginning to the end.
12 I know that there is no good in them, but for a man to rejoice, and to do good in his life.
13 And also that every man should eat and drink, and enjoy the good of all his labor, it is the gift of God.
14 I know that, whatsoever God doeth, it shall be for ever: nothing can be put to it, nor any thing taken from it: and God doeth it, that men should fear before him.
15 That which hath been is now; and that which is to be hath already been; and God requireth that which is past.
Leviticus 18:22 Do not lie with a man as one lies with a woman; that is detestable.
DeleteThere is a time and place for everything, Bucky and Mike is having a funeral service for his Dad today, and that is why I posted that chapter of Ecclesiastes.
DeleteI went by to see Mike at the visitation. He told me to let the forum know I had seen him and that he was doing okay considering the circumstances.
Okay Wordly. You posted that chapter from the Bible without explanation. It appeared to have relevance to the LTEs.
DeleteWordly, thank you for the beautiful posting from Ecclesiastes. We can all take some comfort from it.
DeleteGood afternoon folks!
ReplyDeleteLTE 1: While individuals are free to view marriage as divine or a sacrament or what have you, the state sees it as a contract between 2 parties with certain conditions required for eligibility. How the state defines marriage is a purely secular call as opposed to a theological call. Certain groups have attempted to enact legislation prohibiting Islamic Sharia Code from being utilized as a source for laws, yet we see many here wanting to use a particular interpretation of the Bible as the source for enacting legislation. Regardless of the Koran or the Bible or any other holy book, govt actions must have a secular purpose and any attempt to pass a law to impose a theological viewpoint on the general public should be bounced by the courts.
LTE 2: A no on A.O.
LTE 3: Amendment One is exposing the rift between those who want society to remain static and those who embrace change. History has shown that societal change is inevitable and those who attempt to hold it back wind up falling behind. The CSA is an example of a last gasp effort to preserve a way of life that was rapidly dying out.
LTE 4: The first excuse is aactually irrelevant because it's a theological as opposed to a secular excuse. If someone doesn't wish to marry someone of the same sex for theological reasons, or if a church refuses to allow a same-sex marriage ceremony, then that is their right. The reasons for denying any same sex couple from marrying, however, must be secular in nature. A.O. does nothing to protect marriage. The divorce rate will remain ~50% regardless if it passes or fails. As a civil rights matter, this should really be decided by the US Constitution via the courts rather than the people. As a small minority, gays are at the mercy of the majority in this matter which is completely antithetical to what the country's founders had in mind when they developed a republic with a constitution and a judicial system to ensure minorities weren't run over.
Sum it up: Must have been another "what can we come up with now" day. We have witnessed the results in Salem, MA, and during the Dark Ages as well as modern day ME where they take the Koran literally true. The literal Biblical account of creation has been proven not true and there are many inconsistencies from one book to the next as well as between the OT and the NT that would have to be reconciled. "Eye for an eye" or "offer the other cheek"? As Mr. Chase notes, much of the Bible is allegory and not to be taken literally. I think people would be better off learning the lessons about life the Bible is trying to teach instead of debating whether the event actually occurred exactly as written.
Leviticus 18:22
DeleteD-E-T-E-S-T-A-B-L-E
: arousing or meriting intense dislike : abominable
If you go out into the rural areas of N.C., you will quickly realize there is huge support for passage of the Marriage Protection Amendment. We'll see what happens.
Yes Bucky, this is true I saw the signs on my way down 109 to Thomasville this week, but as I posted last night there are younger people who interested in this matter more so than I would ever have imagined.
DeleteYou are correct that the amendment will probably pass, but I find it quite fascinating that it is contest now.
African Americans are generally not too much on gay marriages. In fact, African Americans are one of the reason Prop 8 carried in California.
DeleteThat hasn't stopped the NAACP from going on the radio against the Marriage Protection Amendment.
http://www.wxii12.com/news/local-news/north-carolina/N-C-NAACP-goes-on-radio-against-marriage-amendment/-/10622650/12149724/-/y187fm/-/index.html
Yes, the Baptists will be busing their bigots to the polls...I hear that some will have stoning practice beforehand to get them worked up.
DeleteBut there has been an intense campaign to register voters on college campuses across the state ahead of the November election. That has been stepped up in hopes of affecting the May primary.
Early voting turnout had been strong so far in the metro areas, especially Fayetteville, Raleigh and Charlotte. That is a good sign.
We'll just have to wait and see.
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DeleteIt's sad what's happened to the southern Baptists. My grandfather was a deacon at Ardmore Baptist and a dyed-in-the-wool yellow dog Democrat...they'd probably drum him out of the church today.
DeleteThe Baptist Church in America was founded at Providence by Roger Williams and others because Williams had been expelled from the Massachusetts Bay colony for being a religious dissenter.
DeleteThroughout the 17th, 18th and 19th centuries, Baptists continued to fight for separation of church and state. The movement in North Carolina to reject the US Constitution as enacted because it did not contain a church/state separation clause was led by Baptists.
And I have been a bit unfair by using the stand alone term "Baptists". There are many, many Baptist Churches in America that still hew to the separation belief, including, locally, such as Knollwood and Wake Forest Baptist.
It is the fundamentalist, know-nothing churches that have set out on a mission to make the law and their pathetic "beliefs" one and the same. They are not true Christians and certainly not true Baptists nor true Americans.
Student Loans:
ReplyDeleteDemocrats have written a version of the bill paid for by raising Social Security and Medicare payroll taxes on high-income owners of some privately owned companies, which GOP senators oppose.
___________
Democrats want to raise taxes. I can't believe that!
It's hard as h-e-double l being both a boy and a christian at the same time.
ReplyDeleteWhen I first learned to read, I read only the Bible, because I was afraid that YHWH would strike me dead if I read the Hardy Boys or Tom Swift or anything else, even the back of cereal boxes. One day I was reading Leviticus and found this passage:
"And YHWH spake unto Moses, saying, 'SPEAK UNTO ALL THE CONGREGATION of the children of Israel, and say unto them, Ye shall be holy: for I YHWH CREATOR am holy. Ye shall not round the corners of your heads, neither shalt thou mar the corners of thy beard. Therefore shall ye observe all My statutes, and all My judgments, and do them: I am YHWH'."
I found this a bit confusing. Did people back then have heads shaped like my blocks? And if so, why would they want to round them off? I was too young to have a beard, but what did "mar" mean? When you live every day in fear of YHWH, questions like that have to be answered, so I consulted a theologian.
He (there were no female theologians in those days) explained that people's heads had always been shaped the same as mine and that YHWH was just having fun with words…what it meant was that you shouldn't shave the sides of your head (so I had sideburns long before Elvis) and that "mar" meant "disfigure", so I shouldn't trim the end of my beard. He went on to explain that YHWH would give me a pass on growing a beard until puberty, but that after that I'd better stay away from the part of the drugstore where they sell razors.
Whew, what a relief! That's why YHWH created theologians…to explain things to us.
But later I was reading Ezekiel and found this:
"They shall neither shave their heads nor let their hair grow long; but they shall keep their hair well trimmed."
So I went to the barber shop and got a crew cut. But then I got to thinking, a most dangerous endeavor for a boy. If Leviticus is true, then how can Ezekiel be true too? Since Leviticus comes way before Ezekiel, does that mean that it is true and if so, why are all barbers not in the "Lake of Fire" that my grandmother had so graphically described to me? Or had the rules changed by the time Ezekiel came along?
I had an old baseball card for Zeke Wilson, who I assumed had written Ezekiel. He pitched in the majors for the Boston Beaneaters and the Cleveland Spiders and the St. Louis Perfectos in the late 1890s. His picture showed that he had a mustache, but no sideburns, so things looked OK.
But when it comes to the temperamental YHWH and the Lake of Fire, you just can't take any chances. So back to the damned theologian.
He gave a little laugh and said "Well, that trimming business is only for the Levites. You're not a Levite are you?" "No, sir," I said, a bit proudly, "I'm an American Cub Scout from Winston-Salem, North Carolina." He smiled. "Well, then, go forth and sin no more," he said.
Today, I look sort of like the famous wrestler Haystack Calhoun, except that both my beard and my hair are a lot longer than his, and my beard is certainly not marred.
D-E-T-E-S-T-A-B-L-E
DeleteLet all ye men go forth and leave ye brothers' heinies alone.
Leviticus 20:23
Chatty Cathy could be the bearded lady at the fair. That might explain her obsession with certain parts of the male anatomy.
DeleteCongressional Contempt:
ReplyDeleteUnder this process, the procedure for holding a person in contempt involves only the chamber concerned.
_______________
I guess AG Holder is getting ready to find out how the procedure works.
Holder is in good company, since 87% of Americans have contempt for Congress.
ReplyDeleteThe 13% who do not are people with IQs under 40 or residents of insane asylums.
“(During a trial in which she was accused of indecency on stage)
DeleteJudge: 'Miss West, are you trying to show contempt for this court?'
Mae West: 'On the contrary, your Honor, I was doin' my best to conceal it.'”
Thanks Bob...one of my all-time favorite quotes.
DeleteI came very close to using it once in a real courtroom but was saved by the bell. Concealing contempt at all the pompous posturing by bailiffs, assistant DAs and some judges in our local district courts has developed into a self-preserving art form.
Here's why the Secret Service agents got into trouble. What real man could resist an apple from one these beauties?
ReplyDeletehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W2K5bvmF6vw&feature=related